There are very few who can come back and be stronger or better in physical shape after a serious injury. Remember the point where we said that Crossfit are like cults? This is part of the scheme. Yeah, yeah, we know that gyms limit each class to a maximum of 20, and programming requires a lot of time and resources, but sometimes you just have to ask yourself- is that huge money sink really worth it?
No matter the physical discipline you choose, the results will depend on hard work, dedication and sticking with the plan. Stick to what you like doing. Stick to your budget or anything that can get you off the couch. Your chances of success will be better. Any other workout should be fine as long as you put in the effort and strive for consistency. It has a few nasty downsides, some of which can put your body out of commission.
Eric Harwood is a former college wrestler and fitness fanatic who specializes in supplements for building muscle. Training is meant to be temporary. Because human beings can and will break. Almost none of us are ever going to the games. Come on, be honest now. So why kill yourself everyday until you inevitably get injured!? Not smart. Almost everyone is. Shoulder Impingements, bad knees, bad backs, tennis elbows, torn rotator cuffs.
Someone is always complaining about how their shoulder hurts or their knee or elbow hurts.. Always, every day. They are not the huge blow out injuries from Football games, they are slow, nagging and degenerative.
And the pullups… Christ on crutch with the kipping pullups! So glad I always went with my knowledge and expertise and never signed up to do full time. Thank you so much for posting this.
I now weigh pounds and look like I can pick up a small car. I ditched crossfit and am back to training as a runner using weight training to supplement. Have you gotten results? I hate how I got so built and thick. Let me k ow how you are doing! I too was wys afraid to lift weights thinking I wouls get bulky. This has been the only thing that works for me. This suer was the first time in 15 years I wore a swimsuit.
Not every box is a good box. I hope everyone here finds what they are lookimg for be it crossfit or not. So I think the issue with soreness from CrossFit is the fact that everybody has to complete the workout even when you start to slow down.
It is when you can no longer perform the reps with speed when your muscle fibers begin to break down. You would be best to stop the exercise when you just start to slow down—at that point, you have stimulated your neuromuscular system for adaptation, but you will not have days of soreness after. CrossFit programming often results in inefficient, unnecessary muscle breakdown and rebuilding.
Tell the coaches, you want to stop the workout at the point where you are slowing down, as a form of scaling rather than scale the weight, scale the reps , but do not predetermine ahead of time. Some coaches will not like it because they have the attitude that you must be encouraged to complete the predetermined reps.
Other wise its a good article and good insight. No one is bashing muscular women. This article is exactly what I was looking for — I can relate! I loved Crossfit — really did! I will be adding more cardio soon. It was the community.
I had a great group that I swore were my friends. That peeved me so I chatted with the head coach. How funny. I dropped the first 10 pounds by, first, taking about a week or so off of all exercise.
I just focused on drinking a LOT of water, eating fresh foods, stretching, and walking. CF left me feeling very inflamed, bloated, swollen, sore, and tired. It took about three months of light exercise moving from walking to short jogs, jump roping, some body weight work like squats, but never to failure to see the really see a change.
But I can say that in the two months after quitting I got rid of a TON of water weight, way more than is normal for me. After I had gotten to a place where I felt happy and more comfortable, I started regularly going to spin classes, running not intensely, just at a conversational pace , and moving back into weighted exercises. I try to leave a bit in the tank. I can run consistently for a month and look leaner. What you described activity-wise is exactly what my instincts tell me I should do…but I stubbornly feel I have to be doing intense HIIT workouts to lose weight.
My fear was that I would get soft and fat immediately, but almost the opposite happened. I would recommend that you give it a month or two of doing something different, lower intensity and longer duration. I found it a huge psychological relief, besides the physical improvements, when I quit CF, but it took about two weeks to come back into perspective. This is a great discussion and such a relief to hear from other women. Even cardio boxing started to bulk my shoulders again.
Hi Suzan, Yes, I agree and thanks for your thoughts. I have a similar experience, gained too much muscle and became completely disproportionate and uncomfortable in my own skin. I can handle few extra pounds but not the overdevelopped upper back wich messed up my posture and give me gorilla look.
I leaned out a bit watching my diet, running occasionally and doing yoga in my overall body, except my upper back which sreeems to get bigger with bodyweight excersize only. Is there a way i can reverse it or i am stuck with it? Great article! I went Paleo for 6 months without doing crossfit and lost 15 pounds, but not in a good way I looked almost ill, and felt very lethargic. If, hypothetically, I went to a crossfit gym and told them I simply did NOT want to do upper body weight-lifting, would they still allow me to join?
Is this possible? Because I am considering going to a crossfit gym tomorrow to ask just that. Also, be aware that you will feel a little out of place when everyone goes to set up their bars for the wod and you are just standing there. My advice is to just stay with the barbell only, no plates 15 lbs which is how you will start out as a beginner. Hey Jessica — the box I go to has a specific class on the schedule three days a week that includes everything except the lifting.
And it costs less! My health and strength are more important than looks. I quit crossfit at the end of because i was bulking up wayy too much! I know I naturally have an athletic build so its easy for me to put on muscle but I thought crossfit would help lean me out…I was wrong!
I tried crossfit for three months and gained 15 lbs of muscle but I looked like a football player! Started bikram yoga and lost some of the bulk already. I realize lifting is not for me or any girl that has a naturally athletic built! Just lift your own body weight and u will get the lean look! I can totally relate to this post!
My body is at its biggest and i hate it! My legs thighs are not getting back to what they were before im doing on and off cardio and HITT and i watch what i eat low carb diet.
I was searching through some pictures of cross fit women after I had a reunion with my family and somebody commenting on my body. I have realized that I also began to have a lot more broader shoulder and thighs. Three years ago, I had very feminine looking body only to gain some muscle to have a tone looking fit body. But after lifting weights so heavy, I am beginning to look very bulky which was not my intention of why I was lifting heavy weights.
And if it had not been said from my mother, I would not have realized that my body composition has changed drastically. I do eat clean for most part — lean meat and clean carbs and greens- but it seems like on top of fat I am gaining muscles.
Learning expensive lesson from my own experience. It is very painful. Going forward, I will still lift but lighter. And now I am trying to incorporate a lot more cardio and eat even more clean so that I can achieve more fit and firm skinny look this summer. I have been physical my entire life doing everything from long distance running, to picking fruit, cleaning, computing for many hours for all of it day after day.
I know as an older woman everything breaks down, this is I know from personal experience. I have been to gyms has personal trainers ran, sit ups and still nothing fixes the degenerative mess I was slowly becoming. Build body mass? Well firstly I lost my 6 kilos of fat have gained muscle thankfully becuase you need that as your getting older.
I thank crossfit for my impoved zest of life, my ability to work harder not just working out. I love the younger woman and how they care about their appearance but if appearance is where its at then I am already finished here.
I just completely quit all explosive movements, weights, sprinting and anything with resistance which was most of the workouts. I saved my money and just jogged and walked for 3 months. Yes, I lost a lot of muscle mass, but that was what I wanted. Now I do the walking and jogging, trampoline stuff, yoga and pilates.
I feel better, no more struggles with tendonitis and bursitis, IT, sciatic pain or burning thighs. But I also eat well. I portion everything to just about the same amount every three hours, never more than 3 oz of protein and always 2 handfuls of leafy greens, every meal. I stay at about 14 percent body fat and wear 2 sizes smaller in all my clothes now. Thank you for this post and for all the replies.
Thank you again for broaching this subject. I was introduced to crossfit after doing a half marathon that left me with severe IT band issues; I knew I needed something different. I fell in love with cf and with the community. I come from a very competitive box. Wow thank you for posting this!! I have been crossfitting for 2 years now and just in the last six months gained 9 lbs of pure muscle — with my lbs of fat staying the same. I feel uncomfortable in non-workout clothes due to big shoulders, big arms, traps, thighs, you name it.
The only big thing I do like is my butt. This is the first article I have read along with all the great comments that finally speaks to the concerns I have had. Paleo is great and I love the concept of eating real whole foods, but I think the emphasis on high fat is preventing me from leaning out.
In the last month I have stopped going to Crossfit and instead been running, biking, playing tennis, and doing Beachbody 30 min videos 21 day fix — I have definitely leaned out and am seeing abs for the first time.. I have also slightly changed my diet — lowering healthy fats and increasing healthy carbs.
Thank you so much for posting I finally feel not crazy!! I have been CFing about 1. The frustration of trying to get on my skinny jeans I owned pre-CF is awful!! I go x a week and really the last mnths is where my thighs have begun to annoy me and now summer is here! Cross Fit!!! You may be better off with MORE cardio …. Also, be prepared that your body may be like mine — muscular — no matter what. DNA girlfriend.
But try dropping to maybe 10 reps sets. I hope this helps. My legs are big — yup. My upper body is more filled out. And not allow yourself time to recover properly. Thank you so much for posting this and also for all of the comments. I am struggling SO hard to undo the results of two years of crossfit. I completely lost all shape in my midsection and can NOT figure out how to get back to normal. I am three months back at gasp a regular gym working out 5 to 6 days a week. Any insight or successes in this manner would be so helpful!
Ok, I understand a lot of the comments so far. I am a Muay Thai, Crossfit loving runner. However, I think a big part of being healthy is being happy. If that means Zumba to you or a jog with your pup, thats great. Heck, eat whatever you want. You can be a healthy vegan and meat eater, its all about quality and moderation.
So diet should not the thing to focus on here… I just felt the need to respond to you advising someone to stop lifting weights and just do cardio.
It is actually the worst advice possible. Women need to preform some form of weighted exercises to help prevent osteoporosis. Not only do weights prevent osteoporosis but muscle mass also increases your metabolism and helps balance hormones. Leading a healthy life as a woman has to include some form of weights. Love this! I was just so bulky and thick I had a six pack but was literally so thick. People commented on how I was a beast or strong like man or I look like I can lift a lot.
And yes I was proud I was so strong. I have a natural build to my body broad shoulders six pack without exercising. So doing crossfit 6 days a week with extra lifting and huge amount of protein I was huge! I had enough for the past month I stopped crossfit style workouts. I took off a week from the gym and I eat a vegetarian based diet no protein supplement so min amount of protein and in that one week I felt amazing!
And already saw changes. Lol there is hope ladies just have to take some rest up the cardio few times a week and decrease your protein intake. It is unfair to blame Crossfit. If you go extreme with anything you will get extreme results. You may even get injured.
To avoid injury, I progress slowly. A lot of commenters sound like they are giving into peer pressure at their Box. I subscribe to the philosophy, everything should be done in moderation. After 6 months of Crossfit days a week, I found myself stronger, faster and ready to tackle a triathlon, so I switched from days to days per week to allow training time for swimming, running and biking.
I also started meeting with a personal trainer at a traditional gym once a week to focus on lighter weight more reps. Once or twice a month I make it to a Zumba class just to mix things up. I find these activities along with eating a balanced diet, and daily stretching have helped me obtain a strong, lean and feminine physique.
Each of us has to find the right balance, and for me Crossfit is definitely part of the equation. Ok, so I am here with you all in. Crazy weights. Thighs rubbing. Going down to 3 days a week and running 3. Hope that moves the scale down so I can fit my clothes not toss them. I crossfit but have never eaten that way.
I just eat healthy and for my body. To be less bulky I just do low weight high reps with just the bar. I had to get back to work at my old box since I went at lunch.
Workouts were average 40 min. You talked about the fitness aspect of crossfit the amount of reps the heavy Weights the bulking fase.
Is is absolutely not true that all crossfit nutrition is based on Paleo. If you know your body and you have enough knowledge you should stick to your gun and do what works for you. Hey everyone, sorry to hear that the women doing CF is bulking up rather than staying lean or losing the fat. Couple that with lifting heavier and heavier, and your newly slim physique is going to gain mass.
I do the Fitness because I need to lose weight, and I know it will tone me down and shape me up better than the Performance. Performance is making sure you can lift certain amount of weights appropriately. I have just started crossfit. So glad I read all of these comments! This month I decided to CrossFit with the weights and I love it better than the bootcamp version.
I hate running and anything that has to do with pushing my lungs to its limits. I am all for embracing the kind of body you want. With the soreness and injury? Maybe I was a weightlifter before a crossfitter but I tend to listen to my body more than peer pressure.
I tend to rest more because I learned that I get better with rest, not with continuous exercise. I hate resting but I have to program it because I have far greater goals than beat my box mates and perform for my coach. Great Post! No barbells or heavy lifting are involved. We use Kettle bells, Barbells when it comes to lifting.
Some women are more prone to bulkiness than others. Fast forward a few months…. At this same time, some personal issues forced me to re-examine my priorities and mental state, and figure out how to incorporate emotional healing into my exercise routine. Granted, I do a vigorous form of yoga where the instructor sometimes curses like a sailor, and it is more time consuming than lifting, but it has worked wonders for my self-esteem and my body.
I do add some interval cardio on my off days. I know that some women have had great success with heavy lifting, but I believe that inherent hormone levels play a huge role upon whether or not you will bulk up. I have higher testosterone levels than the average woman, and my muscles respond more like a mans when I lift heavy.
Vigorous yoga keeps my muscles long and lean and is more suited to my short frame and body type. And finally, spending some time on stetching and foam rolling will always make your body feel better, I think you should keep doing that.
Interesting post. I identify with a lot of the reasons you stopped doing CrossFit, but not all of them. I found that my body has changed for the better. I naturally have a thick waist and narrow hips, very far from hourglass. Lifting heavy has broadened my back and rear, actually helping to create a more balanced appearance!
I am in my mids. I did not knowingly change my diet, but gained both muscle and fat, and could no longer fit into most of clothes, particularly my jackets and blazers I need to wear to work. I am more of an athletic apple-shape, and most of my visible gain was in my upper arms, shoulders, and traps, and a little in my quads too.
I also started developing a little bit of cellulite I never had any before! I am going to use this blog in my assignment work you have done the remarkable job really!! Great Article I personally love weight training due to tempo control.
Nothing wrong with crossfit at least america is staying in shape. Crossfit can keep reboks and crossfitter pull ups. Bodybuilders can keep their pyramid sets and their barbell curls. Brad Chase maybe you should check out training videos with Kal Greene, he does 20 not 10 so I do not know where you get your number of reps. You clearly love cross fit but there are a couple of points or inaccuracies I can punch holes through.
I am able to sweat a bucket load through body building, lift weights with intensity, do high and low reps weight lifting and do cardio in mins and feel exhausted. It just depends on how you train. Glassman was right, stupid people such as the author is most dangerous, not any kind of exercises. The ignorance shown by the author of this fourth-grade level piece is jaw-dropping. Froning taking dope? Try muscle up that ring without peeing your pants. We all have one goal, to be fit. So stop hating.
Also a lot of the best trainers in the world for bodybuilding and powerlifting didnt go to school to learn what they know. My personal biggest problem with crossfit, is the programming. It leaves you vulnerable to injuries. Example: Putting heavy snatches almost last in the training session after doing some other really hard exercises that really take it out of you.
You need to be somewhat fresh and alert to do those Olympic style lifts safely. If they can correct their programming and clean up their form a little bit, it can be a lot safer and better for you. That happens and it is unfortunate. So you challenged body builders to do crossfit…do a real body building program for once and then compare.
Man up! Horribly misguided and uneducated article. You really need to do more research. I think that people should stop pointing out flaws with other training.
Each person either enjoys a specific way they train or they have a specific goal. The type of training you perform should be relevant to your goals. I thought this was going to be an unbiased comparison but it ended up being a Crossfit cock stroking session.
BTW Crossfit drug tests are so far from being intense or thorough and definitely not random. You can see women competing one year looking like a normal muscular female and coming back the next with a distended abdomen,somewhat severe acne and her fucking brow line has grown.
All of which are very common signs of PED use. Not cool. It will always be healthier to do a difficult exercises, times, rest and repeat. My buddy who does crossfit alot just showed me this. It strikes me as odd that people are so venomous. You guys realize crossfit and bodybuilding while similar have very different goals. A bodybuilder is trying to pack on as much muscle as humanly possible with the lowest body fat.
They have a bit of muscle,a bit of strength,a bit of flexibility and a bit of endurance. No one beats a runner at endurance, a yoga master at flexibility a powerlifter at strength a bodybuilder at muscle.
This is not a putdown by any means balancing that many things is hard. But by its very nature the more muscle you have the heavier you are the less endurance youll have.
That works for every category up there you cant be great at all of them. Crossfit has proven you can be reasonably decent at all of them i think its nice to have that option. And last but not least intensity.
Id disagree with the author any advanced workout in any of the above categories will make a grown man cry. I think cross fit is cool and I actually respect the amazing amount of intensity involved in it.
However, I had no idea that there was so much animosity with cross fitters. Brad Chase, it seems as though you put out this article due to some sort of insecurity issue you are suffering from. This article is a joke and incredibly ignorant. Not all bodybuilders think a like. I think cross fit and bodybuilding are both impressive in there own way.
Your article sounds like it was written by a 12 year old boy who got called skinny or something and got his feelings hurt. They mistake difficulty with progress. They seem more concerned with showing off than improving.
Hence the reason so many of them cheat and do gimmicky workouts that look cool but are pointless. Basically cross fit is extremely inefficient and there are a lot of wasted movements.
When a lot of amateur body builders weigh less but can also out lift pro cross fitters, you may want to step back and take a look at your sport. Crossfit in itself has a great place in the fitness industry. It emphasizes muscle endurance, core strength, and overall body control. However, just like everything else, it must be done correctly to achieve the above description. Both have their pros and cons, however when suplemented correctly with one another, can increase overall health and fitness, than just staying stagnated with one style of working out day in and day out.
Circuit training and crossfit are very similar, non stop and high repetitions. The return on investment of time is well worth it, in my opinion. Try 50 lbs and reps!
Generally I just walk away. This is the biggest joke. Be a man and do a real pull up…. Because everyone can do that…. Stick to gymnastics. Because everyone can do that. Crossfit and bodybuilding are two completely different animals. I have my level 1 and I understand the science and philosophy behind it. If done properly it is a great foundation for any type of athlete.
I do have some criticisms about the competency of some coaches but there are good and bad coaches in every sport. I imagine there are a lot in bodybuilding as well. Crossfit celebrates high intensity and functional movement. The goal is to be ready for any and all physical challenges one would face in life.
The goal of bodybuilding goes a different direction from what I understand. They do very well. Crossfit is better than bodybuilding for improving our capacity to do functional work. However, by doing crossfit you will get a lean and fit body. Just like by bodybuilding you will become stronger and your capacity to do work will improve.
CrossFit can make you extremely sore and under the right circumstances, it can lead to Rhabdo, a very serious condition that requires immediate medical attention.
Energy and mass are NOT thing, nor stuff at all. Bring it on you cocksucker. Read that again, you laughably science illiterate Internet commenter…..
If you do any of these on a competitive level you will probably end up with joint ink. I powerlifter for over 25 yrs and yes I can hardly move now. Doctor Arthritis is everywhere, I have to take pretty strong opioids for pain. Total knee replacements, drugs shot into every joint I have. LOL I loved competing at meets. Be careful with your bodies, you only get one. If Crossfit does that for you, then more power to you, if Bodybuilding does it, then Awesome, if neither work for you, then do something else, be it Yoga, Martial Arts, cycling, running, swimming, whatever.
A white guy has no place in a gym just like a black man has no place in a class room. No great thinkers were black, blacks can only run jump and lift heavy things that is why they try to go to prison. So you should stop talking about energy because all you can do is lift weights and you will be in jail because all crimes are because of black people.
A bodybuilder when preparing for a show is utterly and truly devoted to the relentless pursuit of acquiring a better physique through precise nutrition, drugs,training and mindset. An Olympian is totally immersed in a precise ans specific sequence of movements, which he or she does repeatedly, thousands of times till perfection is achieved.
Same with someone like a classical music composer. Sure , you may be tired after a Crossfit session; but being tired and being intense are two very different things.
Those guys are body builders, no Olympic athlete crossfits because it is dangerous and fucking stupid. Anyone with any sort of intelligence about the human body know lifting too much weight with improper form to the point of exhaustion is a recipe for a fucked up body.
The amount of injuries, especially shoulders, that I witnessed through the country I travel for work led me to really reevaluate what the hell I was doing. CF injuries are horribly under reported. The folks at the boxes I frequented had a tendency to down play and even hide their injuries for fear of ridicule. Shit the level to which the elites are fighting injuries is insane.
No one in CF is talking about it because the money train is chugging! People are getting injured doing lb snatches! How does that happen?!?! Total lack of respect for the skill and art of Olys. But, none of this is the real reason I left. There is no feeling in the world that compares to the pump and gains. Outside of a handful of the elites CF dudes are so small. Gains are minimal. I was the strongest guy at most of the boxes I worked out at and that was never the case at any of my previous gyms.
They thought I was the hulk. Weight training and HIIT are superior for strength and fat loss. There is no reason to do CF unless you want to watch half naked girls lift…hmm… It was a great community but you can find that at the gym, church, or the bar.
Gains and pump. No better feeling. CF will slow down soon. CF was awesome in the sense that it has created a lot of amateur weight lifters that are doing their research, and questioning the machine. Find a real trainer, pick up the fuckin barbell, and grow every day. You have to push yourself to get those extra reps when every fiber of your being is telling you to stop.
During competition prep you have to have an iron will to keep your macros on point. It is true that, working out the way I do, jumping straight into a CF workout would probably kick my ass. Bodybuilding is about tearing down and rebuilding muscle tissue. CF is about athleticism. It still takes time, patience, and practice. Get above the bar, get up the rope, move that weight from there to there as quick as possible. Top CF athletes are total badasses but so are top Bodybuilders. The mentality is different, the sport is different, the goals are different.
Just do what you do the best you can and meet your goals. The rest is pure childish aguments. I will give a new perspective on this. I love strong looking crossfit women. So hot. Crossfit is retarded but I like some of the women. I lift heavy in the real rep range Unless they are on a shitload of gear most bodybuilders lift like preteen girls. Walking around in the gym, pumping up their muscles, totally in love with themselves doing their stupid 40 sets hitting the muscle with 5 different exercises.
Then guys like me walk in, no checking myself out in the mirror or snapping selfies to post on instagram to feed my narcissistic vanity. I cardio warmup, stretch and lie down and bench press way more weight, arm curl with way more weight and basically do everything with way more weight. My workouts are maybe sets on a good day 3 sometimes 4 times a week.
I see the same guys in times a week doing no warmup, no pre or post workout cardio and usually start off with their stupid cable crossovers first thing one of the most useless exercises on earth.
Can you tell I have contempt for bodybuilders. All show and no go. Unless of course they take a shitload of gear and have great genetics, then they are strong as can be. However the rest of them are vain self absorbed preteen girls. At least in my town. Maybe its not like that in other places.
I dont know, maybe I am wrong in other areas. I wont even get into the fact that every 3rd woman in the gym who actually lifts weight is an amateur figure or bikini model or aspiring one. Another vanity driven bullshit hobby. Yes I said hobby because bodybuilding is a hobby the same as model railroading.
Bodybuilders are in no shape or form athletes. However if I was forced to call either the males or female bodybuilders an athlete I would hands down call the women the athletes. Most of the women figure models bikini models are just a totally useless classification I see in the gym work out like crazy and put all the men to shame.
Very few guys can keep up with the hardcore woman lifter, even if they spend too much time doing glute stuff. Oh and one of the reasons listed above they say crossfitters are not athletes. When if you ever watch the Reebok games or regional games they look pretty friggin athletic to me. Bodybuilders are only good for one thing. Get all dark and oiled up in a speedo and prance around on a stage in front of a largely gay audience and then walk around patting each other on their asses.
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Submit Comment. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. Join Us. A special note to the reader from Coach Dai When this post went live on January 21st, I had no idea that it would receive as much activity as it has.
Look At Those Beautiful Curls! Tory on January 21, at PM. Dai on January 21, at PM. Tory, I loved your comments and perspective. Thank you so much for sharing. Renato on June 1, at AM. JayMan on June 26, at AM. This guy gets it Reply. Martha on January 21, at PM. Brad Chase on January 21, at PM. Unfortunately, many people have the experience you have due to coaching that could be improved.
Its all about finding the right box. They are definitely not all created equal. Cody on January 21, at PM. Bree on January 24, at AM. Phimes on January 24, at PM. In both activities. Dai on September 11, at AM. Well said, Nikolai. Coaching makes all the difference. Hahahah on January 27, at PM.
Louise on December 11, at AM. Phill on May 14, at PM. Brita on January 27, at PM. Kristie on August 6, at PM. Nick Van on January 22, at AM. Rex Rogers on January 22, at AM. It takes one class to become a Pilates instructor. Heck maybe even online. LS on January 24, at PM. Travis Friedel on March 1, at PM. LOL… Pilates… Reply. Brad Chase on January 27, at AM. Hi Nick, You bring up some good points. Vasko Dimoski on September 1, at AM. Functional strength on July 2, at AM. Get outta here.
VoodooChyld on January 22, at PM. Greg on August 7, at AM. MechMan on May 12, at PM. Judo and rugby are both very intensive sports. James on January 22, at PM. Lynn on January 23, at PM. James, YOU are a douchebag!
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